18 Nov 2024 23:21:27
White Sox 2024-25 Mock Offseason

Free Agents:

1. RHP Jakob Junis - 2/$20 million
2. OF Max Kepler - 1/$7 million + 2025 club option
3. LHP Jose Quintana - 1/$11 million
4. SS/2B Nicky Lopez - 1/$2 million
5. 1B/OF Mark Canha - 1/$5 million
6. RHP Ryne Stanek - 1/$4 million
7. C Elias Diaz - 1/$5 million

Trades:

Red Sox Get: LHP Garrett Crochet, RHP Steven Wilson
White Sox Get: DH/OF Masataka Yoshida, 2B/SS David Hamilton, 2B/OF Kristian Campbell, OF Braden Montgomery, RHP Jedixon Paez

Marlins Get: OF Oscar Colas
White Sox Get: C Paul McIntosh

Lineup:

1. David Hamilton 2B (L)
2. Masataka Yoshida DH (L)
3. Luis Robert Jr. OF (R)
4. Max Kepler RF (L)
5. Elias Diaz C (R)
6. Andrew Benintendi LF (L)
7. Bryan Ramos 3B (R)
8. Nicky Lopez 2B (L)
9. Miguel Vargas 1B (R)

Bench:
- Mark Canha 1B/OF (R)
- Lenyn Sosa 2B (R)
- Korey Lee C (R)
- Dominic Fletcher OF (L)

Rotation:

1. Jose Quintana (L)
2. Jonathan Cannon (R)
3. Jakob Junis (R)
4. Davis Martin (R)
5. Drew Thorpe (R)

Bullpen:

- Ryne Stanek (R)
- Justin Anderson (R)
- Prelander Berroa (R)
- Gus Varland (R)
- Fraser Ellard (L)
- Jared Schuster (L)
- Ron Marinaccio (R)
- Penn Murphee (R)

1.) 19 Nov 2024
19 Nov 2024 12:22:22
You're literally suggesting the White Sox will add nearly SEVENTY MILLION in salary in 2025, after all the reports that the White Sox are seeking to reduce payroll in 2025?

"We're not going to be working heavy in free agency" is a direct quote from Chris Getz himself (NBC Sports Chicago) . Adding seven (7) free agents is the definition of "working heavy in free agency.

After all the haranguing you did about how the White Sox would turn down Paul Skenes himself because he isn't a hitter, because of the "reports", certainly you should take the White Sox GM at his word regarding payroll/ free agency, no?

2.) 19 Nov 2024
19 Nov 2024 15:06:33
This puts them $18 million below last season.

3.) 19 Nov 2024
19 Nov 2024 18:16:47
Uhh, no it doesn't.

Let's try some simple arithmetic. The running total will be in parantheses. Arbitration are estimates from MLBTR.

Yoshida- 18.6 (18.6)
Benintendi- 15 (33.6)
Robert- 15 (48.6)
Quintana- 11 (59.6)
Junis- 10 (69.6)
Kepler- 7 (76.6)
Canha- 5 (81.6)
Diaz- 5 (86.6)
Stanek- 4 (90.6)
Lopez- 2 (92.6)

Arbitration Players
Vaughn- 6.5 (99.1)
Sheets- 2.6 (101.7)
De Los Santos- 1.8 (103.5)
Lambert- 1.2 (104.7)
Anderson- 1.1 (105.8)
Foster- 0.9 (106.7)
Murfee- 0.8 (107.5)

Now we got to add in buy outs, which work against the 2025 numbers:
Moncada- 5 (112.5)
Brebbia- 1.5 (114)
Jimenez (CHW agreed to pay the buyout in the trade) - 1.5 (115.5)
Stassi- 0.5 (116)
Maldonado- 0.25 (116.25)

So at first glance, it looks like it's under the 125M number, by about 9 million. But unfortunately, we're not done.

The White Sox also have to factor in benefits and pre-arb players, as well as MLB Bonus Pool money (all of which was factored into the 2024 payroll) :

Per RosterResource, he's the estimates:
Player Benefits- 17.5 (133.75)
Pre-Arb Salaries- 18.25 (152)
Bonus Pool Share- 1.67 (153.67)

That's $28 million MORE in payroll than 2024.

4.) 19 Nov 2024
19 Nov 2024 20:50:53
Why are you factoring in Vaughn, Sheets, De Los Santos, Lambert, Foster? They're not included in the plan. You can't just add $13 million lol. Let's slow down and read bud.

The pre arb salaries are 760k x 15 players, so $11.4 million, not $18.25 million. Then 18.25 by RR is assuming the roster they currently have.

If you're going off RosterResource, they were at $150 million last year, so even if you factor in the player benefits & bonus pool share, we're at $135 million, so 15 million under, not 18. You found $3 million.

Happy to help you with the details.

5.) 20 Nov 2024
20 Nov 2024 11:02:57
"If you're going off RosterResource, they were at $150 million last year"

Cots has the CBT payroll at $131M
Spotrac has it at 125M

I have no clue how Jason Martinez/ RR found 19-25M more than those two, but it's pretty clear his number is much higher than the rest. If we go by the consensus, the White Sox are spending more money in 2025 than they did in 2025.

EVEN IF you desire to use the highest payroll you can find to defend the spending, we still have a problem, and it's the pesky little quote from Chris Getz:

"We're not going to be working heavy in free agency"

Adding seven free agents kind of goes against that, now doesn't it?

6.) 21 Nov 2024
21 Nov 2024 15:54:57
"EVEN IF you desire to use the highest payroll you can find to defend the spending"

My guy, you're the one that used RR to break down the Sox payroll, and you were way off with your "simple arithmetic". I'm just referencing your point of reference.

Spotrac and Cots are not factoring in the buyouts they paid last offseason (Liam Hendriks, etc. ) . Point is, if you're consistent as to what exactly is counted (from last year to what I have proposed this year), I'm at least $15 million under.

You're also taking that Getz quote out of context. He was asked by Steve Stone on air about big names like Juan Soto and how their largest all-time commitment is Andrew Benintendi. Stone knew the answer, but he just wanted Getz to say it.

Sure, 7 Free agents is busy, but they average $6 million AAV. Quintana and Stanek were admittedly late adds - they could be purged here to bring '25 commitments to just $29 million.

This could also be what I would do (realistically) as White Sox GM, not necessarily a prediction. Getz may have a mandate to keep the payroll well under $100 million. That doesn't make me wrong, it's just not how I (or maybe even Getz) would go about this rebuild.

You're getting big mad about finances, but clearly don't understand the details of an MLB payroll. You've not included buyouts, included non-tendered players, added too much pre-arb money, etc. Don't worry, I'm here to help.

7.) 21 Nov 2024
21 Nov 2024 18:05:04
"This could also be what I would do (realistically) as White Sox GM, not necessarily a prediction. Getz may have a mandate to keep the payroll well under $100 million. That doesn't make me wrong, it's just not how I (or maybe even Getz) would go about this rebuild. "

If I'm not mistaken, you got big mad about me proposing a completely fair, but hypothetical trade idea all because it doesn't give the White Sox bats, mostly due to it going against what Getz has reportedly stated he was looking for.

But now, you go on and ignore what Getz actually said, in a real quote, and create your own hypothetical and I'm not allowed to call you out for it?

I applaud your commitment to inconsistent standards on this forum. It's about the only thing you do well around here.

8.) 21 Nov 2024
21 Nov 2024 18:16:44
"Spotrac and Cots are not factoring in the buyouts they paid last offseason (Liam Hendriks, etc. ) . I'm at least $15 million under. "

Liam Hendriks and the White Sox agreed to pay the buyout over the course of 10 years, which amounts to 1.5M per year.

So you're actually only 1.5M under.

Don't worry, when you need more factually correct information, I'm here to help!

9.) 21 Nov 2024
21 Nov 2024 21:41:39
"But now, you go on and ignore what Getz actually said, in a real quote, and create your own hypothetical and I'm not allowed to call you out for it? "

Having trouble reading? I said you took it out of context (shocker) . This is one of your main issues. You don't really know how this stuff works, so important context goes right over your head. There's a difference in me saying that the Sox will looking for hitting headliners for Crochet, per Getz's comments (which, by the way, also makes complete sense when you slow down & think given their current farm system), vs. you taking a Chris Getz quote out of context and thinking it means the same thing. I know we usually have to keep things really simple for you to understand, but my goodness, lol.

"Liam Hendriks and the White Sox agreed to pay the buyout over the course of 10 years, which amounts to 1.5M per year.

So you're actually only 1.5M under. "

You now splicing together what I said leaving out the important context in the middle. Holy hell, this is like talking to a 2nd grader. As long as you're consistent with what is actually included in the payroll (we've demonstrated that the sources vary), I have not spent more money in my plan than the Sox spent last year. Are you able to understand that at this point, or are you still getting confused by all the big, complex numbers that you have to add together? I know it can be hard for ya.

You asked where RR got the extra $. They have Hendriks at 15M, not the 1.5 per year structure. I was providing you an answer to your question. That's not where I'm under though. You didn't understand the concept of what a non-tender is or how pre-arb numbers are calculated, that's where your initial math was off, that's all.

You spent the time listing out the entire Sox payroll from my plan. The only problem was that it was flat wrong.

10.) 21 Nov 2024
21 Nov 2024 21:50:31
One other thing you should also know - the benefits & bonus pool allocations are part of their Luxury Tax payroll for league compliance. That is NOT the same value that is reported at the top of the Roster Resource page on FanGraphs ($150 million) . Payroll and luxury tax payroll are not the same, and it may be where you're getting confused across sources.

They were actually at $150 million WITHOUT those benefits paid (or $136.5 million if you correct the Hendriks situation) in 2024. I'm at $115.95 million in my plan (again, no benefits) .

Hopefully you're able to wrap your head around this ultra-complex math I was able to do. I have not spent more money.

11.) 22 Nov 2024
22 Nov 2024 15:20:35
"They were actually at 150 million without those benefits"

Shot.

" (or 136.5 million if you correct the Hendriks situation"

Chaser.

That's a difference of 13.5M, which isn't insignificant. Why not just say "they were actually at 136.5M"?

Oh, that's right, because it makes your "they are way under 2024 payroll" when that payroll is reflected at 150M, and not 13.5M less.

12.) 22 Nov 2024
22 Nov 2024 16:48:12
Ok, so we've established that my plan at $116 million is less than both 136.5 million and 150 million!

Glad we could finally get you there!

13.) 22 Nov 2024
22 Nov 2024 18:16:05
"My plan"

Nice of you to concede that you're not dealing in reality at all.

Glad you finally admit it to the world!

14.) 26 Nov 2024
26 Nov 2024 09:10:07
Why do you two like each other so much?

15.) 02 Dec 2024
02 Dec 2024 12:13:09
Look at the way Chi Sox talks down to others.

Then go look at how awful and unrealistic her own ideas are.

Now ask yourself: would I like someone like this? (The answer is no, you would not) .