04 Jan 2017 02:40:44
Jays: Melvin Upton Jr. OF, Devon Travis 2B, Anthony Alford OF, Sean Reid-Foley SP and Max Pentecost C

For

Pirates: Andrew McCutchen OF and Josh Harrison 2B.

1.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 05:38:15
Quantity doesn't equal quality. This is bad. You got an overpaid outfielder in Upton, a flop of a prospect in Travis, to decent prospects and often injured catching prospect. No chance the Pirates except that.

2.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 10:17:54
Devon Travis is a flop? Now I know for sure you are out to lunch Batman!

He just had a couple of freak injuries that has slowed him down. He is an average defender but man he's a good hitter.

Jay's will not give up that many prospects for a couple years of McCutchen.

As far as Upton goes. He is getting paid 5mil this year from the Jay's. If he steals 20 bases and hits 20 Homer's, he's done his job as a platoon outfielder. Oakland just paid 6mil for Davis for a similar role, except his for mainly base stealing.

So two top 100 prospects, Travis (when healthy was the Jay's best hitter) Upton on the cheap and Pentecost was a good prospect but is battling back from injuries will not be going for two years of McCutchen.

3.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 14:20:01
Minnow, for crying out loud, you're not giving up all that for "a couple years of McCutchen. " You're also getting 4 years of Josh Harrison, who is insanely underrated. You forgot about Harrison, who is on a ridiculously cheap contract, considering the talent.

Also, let's talk about how bullish you are on these guys:

Travis is good, but the injuries. They happened in the minors as well. At this point, you can't expect him to stay healthy, and his value sinks tremendously because of it.

And your statement on Melvin Upton, you've got to be kidding, right? The guy is not good. He has not been good. And your comparison of him to Rajai Davis is equally as bad. Davis is 4 years older and over the last 4 years has posted 6.3 WAR, Upton's is 2.5.

A 36-year-old journey man is nearly 3 times better than Upton and only gets paid $1M more. That's not good value for Upton.

As for the package, it's more than fair. You're getting a guy who everyone seems to think will bounce back and be the MVP caliber player and a guy who can be a 3-5 WAR player in his better years. Realistically, you're trading for a potential of over 10 WAR and giving up probably 4-5 in current value.

Yeah, if the Pirates would take this deal (they won't), you'd be sure to bet the Blue Jays would laugh all the way to bank after saying yes.

4.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 15:57:47
Jay's will not give up their prospects for what years of McCutchen, regardless if it's fair or not.

I didn't say Upton was good in my post, I said for 5 mil next year, that's what you can expect from a platoon guy. 20 Homer's 20 steals.

Jay's would love to have McCutchen, but they won't give up young assets for him. They are aging as it is with one of the older teams in the mlb.

Two more points.

If Travis stays healthy this year, and his injuries were rare so no reason to think he won't, his numbers will be very good.

I'm not really an NL guy, but I've read more that McCutchens career is in the decline and not a good chance for a bounce back mvp year. Time will tell I guess.

5.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 18:01:37
So Travis has had good number in the Minors and only played 163 games in the Majors, a whole season. Not enough to convince me he's going to be good. This is just a sample size. Now a couple years down the road if Travis can keep up the numbers then I will retract my statement.

6.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 20:02:10
He's hit at all levels but you said he is a flop. You have a bias against the Jay's my friend.

7.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 22:01:39
You said he's comparable to Rajai Davis at the dollar amount. No, he's not. Rajai Davis is nearly three times the player, is 4 years older, and only $1M more. Upton, at $5M is grossly overpaid. They have 2-3 guys in their AAA system who could put up similar numbers, as do the Pirates, why would the Pirates want him? He's useless.

Once again, you ignore the fact that they aren't just getting McCutchen, they are also getting Harrison in this idea. That's TWO major league starters for an oft-injured one and a bunch of fluff pieces.

If Travis stays injured, sure, he might be good. But at this point, expecting him to stay healthy a full year is expecting to win the powerball jackpot. Don't. He hasn't been able to stay healthy even in the minors. This isn't some fluky streak for him, it's his identity as a player. That pulls down a ton of value.

Again, you seem stuck on the McCutchen part of the trade and keep forgetting, or ignoring, the Harrison side of it. Adding Harrison actually makes this a complete undersell for the Pirates. They are losing a potential 10 WAR and getting almost no current value in return. They would say no to this deal in a heartbeat.

8.) 04 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 23:20:12
I'm not arguing the Upton part of this proposal. It's the Jay's giving up prospects for McCutchen when everybody knows their has been a management shift. The Jay's will not be good enough next year so my opinion would be not to give up young prospects for 2 years of McCutchen. He will not lead them to a championship.

Harrison is an average 2nd baseman. And he is 30. They'll take their chances with Travis.

No offence to you Jay's fan, but the whole trade wasn't really thought out because Pittsburgh already said they want ready now prospects and the Jay's really won't give up two of the very few top 100 prospects in the system.

Now if could unload one of our stellar starting pitchers and a couple prospects for a ready now young outfielder. Now we are talking.

9.) 05 Jan 2017
04 Jan 2017 23:46:54
Harrison is far better than Devon Travis. He is a poor man's Ben Zobrist. I doubt Travis + Reid-Foley would be enough for just him. Adding in Alford wouldn't be enough for Pittsburgh to also add McCutchen.

For Harrison (and several cheap years of him) + McCutchen, you're talking Aaron Sanchez.

You think it's bad for Toronto. It's really not. This would be a massive steal, and one that Huntington won't even consider.

10.) 05 Jan 2017
05 Jan 2017 03:23:21
Your really missing my point.

The Jay's don't have the luxury of giving up prospects for McCutchen. If he was younger or under contract longer, that would be a different conversation. And of course Pittsburgh would want more. They aren't good trade partners here.

Jay's need a younger left handed leadoff type player. That would be ideal.

11.) 05 Jan 2017
05 Jan 2017 05:45:54
Minnow, how many guys have come up from the minors who were good hitters and it didn't translate in the Majors. A lot, Travis' numbers are a small sample size, until he comes up and plays more than 100 games in a season and hits consistently over several seasons then like I said I will retract my statement.

12.) 05 Jan 2017
05 Jan 2017 06:44:42
BATMAN! You are making absolutely zero sense, so Travis is a flop, because he has played very well in a limited but extended period of time?

13.) 05 Jan 2017
05 Jan 2017 14:04:59
Flop may have been the wrong word, maybe overrated or unproven.